Veronica's Law of Attraction Forum / I'm troubled

**Posted by fizzy** 9/26/2018 8:57 am

oceanitrogen wrote:
My point here is: We're cocreaters. Not creaters. Why do we need to let it go and put it in the hands of the Universe to do it for us? Because it's the Universe (God) who has the real power. We simply have the power to cocreate with it. But it is the Universe who does it all for us. We're not Gods exactly because of that. We don't have the power to create new things, we can only take what the universe gives us and manipulate it, but we're not able to create things from nothing. And if everything was our conciousness, people wouldn't be so different from us and see things differently and perceive things their own way exactly because we don't have that ability to create things from nothing. If everything was our conciousness, that's mean that we create a reality where people are absurdly different from everything we are and believe and we create that out of nothing because it doesn't exist inside us. And our subconcious is not able to create people and differences. It is not. We can't even create faces. When we dream, we dream faces we have seen before. Our brain isn't able to create. We are not able to create. Because creating is having nothing and building something. Humans can only modify what already exists, but we cannot create. We cocreate. Yeah. I think I finally put it into words in a way that makes sense.

That’s extremely limiting. But if you are comfortable placing those limits on yourself and your abilities, then that’s ok and you won’t experience anything beyond those limits. I’m not saying this to be mean, but I do hope you manage to “attract” your SP back then. Nothing is impossible, but you are saying you believe that there are some impossibilities and you’re adamant about keeping these viewpoints. So I’m not sure I personally could give you any more advice because I’m not sure what falls within your limits and what doesn’t.

Also as a side note: I’ve had dreams about people and places I’ve never seen before in my life. Also dreams that are really off the wall. It’s definitely possible to dream of things you’ve never seen before.

Last edited by fizzy (9/26/2018 9:04 am)

**Posted by oceanitrogen** 9/26/2018 1:34 pm

fizzy wrote:
oceanitrogen wrote:
My point here is: We're cocreaters. Not creaters. Why do we need to let it go and put it in the hands of the Universe to do it for us? Because it's the Universe (God) who has the real power. We simply have the power to cocreate with it. But it is the Universe who does it all for us. We're not Gods exactly because of that. We don't have the power to create new things, we can only take what the universe gives us and manipulate it, but we're not able to create things from nothing. And if everything was our conciousness, people wouldn't be so different from us and see things differently and perceive things their own way exactly because we don't have that ability to create things from nothing. If everything was our conciousness, that's mean that we create a reality where people are absurdly different from everything we are and believe and we create that out of nothing because it doesn't exist inside us. And our subconcious is not able to create people and differences. It is not. We can't even create faces. When we dream, we dream faces we have seen before. Our brain isn't able to create. We are not able to create. Because creating is having nothing and building something. Humans can only modify what already exists, but we cannot create. We cocreate. Yeah. I think I finally put it into words in a way that makes sense.
That’s extremely limiting. But if you are comfortable placing those limits on yourself and your abilities, then that’s ok and you won’t experience anything beyond those limits. I’m not saying this to be mean, but I do hope you manage to “attract” your SP back then. Nothing is impossible, but you are saying you believe that there are some impossibilities and you’re adamant about keeping these viewpoints. So I’m not sure I personally could give you any more advice because I’m not sure what falls within your limits and what doesn’t.

Also as a side note: I’ve had dreams about people and places I’ve never seen before in my life. Also dreams that are really off the wall. It’s definitely possible to dream of things you’ve never seen before.

Not according so science, no. You wouldn't know if you have seen them before. That's the thing. Your subconcious mind mixes what it knows, but it does not have the ability to create things it has never seen before. And it's not limiting. I don't feel limited. I feel grateful and powerful knowing I have power enough to manifest whatever I'd like. It's not upsetting for me to not be a God. I'm good with being His creation.

Last edited by oceanitrogen (9/26/2018 1:35 pm)

**Posted by Cynthia** 9/26/2018 1:57 pm

oceanitrogen wrote:
fizzy wrote:
oceanitrogen wrote:
My point here is: We're cocreaters. Not creaters. Why do we need to let it go and put it in the hands of the Universe to do it for us? Because it's the Universe (God) who has the real power. We simply have the power to cocreate with it. But it is the Universe who does it all for us. We're not Gods exactly because of that. We don't have the power to create new things, we can only take what the universe gives us and manipulate it, but we're not able to create things from nothing. And if everything was our conciousness, people wouldn't be so different from us and see things differently and perceive things their own way exactly because we don't have that ability to create things from nothing. If everything was our conciousness, that's mean that we create a reality where people are absurdly different from everything we are and believe and we create that out of nothing because it doesn't exist inside us. And our subconcious is not able to create people and differences. It is not. We can't even create faces. When we dream, we dream faces we have seen before. Our brain isn't able to create. We are not able to create. Because creating is having nothing and building something. Humans can only modify what already exists, but we cannot create. We cocreate. Yeah. I think I finally put it into words in a way that makes sense.
That’s extremely limiting. But if you are comfortable placing those limits on yourself and your abilities, then that’s ok and you won’t experience anything beyond those limits. I’m not saying this to be mean, but I do hope you manage to “attract” your SP back then. Nothing is impossible, but you are saying you believe that there are some impossibilities and you’re adamant about keeping these viewpoints. So I’m not sure I personally could give you any more advice because I’m not sure what falls within your limits and what doesn’t.

Also as a side note: I’ve had dreams about people and places I’ve never seen before in my life. Also dreams that are really off the wall. It’s definitely possible to dream of things you’ve never seen before.
Not according so science, no. You wouldn't know if you have seen them before. That's the thing. Your subconcious mind mixes what it knows, but it does not have the ability to create things it has never seen before. And it's not limiting. I don't feel limited. I feel grateful and powerful knowing I have power enough to manifest whatever I'd like. It's not upsetting for me to not be a God. I'm good with being His creation.

One's subconscious beliefs are exactly what creates their life and experiences, but, as I said before, you can believe whatever you want to, although, as fizzy said, your beliefs are very limiting.

Last edited by Cynthia (9/26/2018 1:58 pm)

**Posted by oceanitrogen** 9/26/2018 8:33 pm

Cynthia wrote:
oceanitrogen wrote:
fizzy wrote:

That’s extremely limiting. But if you are comfortable placing those limits on yourself and your abilities, then that’s ok and you won’t experience anything beyond those limits. I’m not saying this to be mean, but I do hope you manage to “attract” your SP back then. Nothing is impossible, but you are saying you believe that there are some impossibilities and you’re adamant about keeping these viewpoints. So I’m not sure I personally could give you any more advice because I’m not sure what falls within your limits and what doesn’t.

Also as a side note: I’ve had dreams about people and places I’ve never seen before in my life. Also dreams that are really off the wall. It’s definitely possible to dream of things you’ve never seen before.
Not according so science, no. You wouldn't know if you have seen them before. That's the thing. Your subconcious mind mixes what it knows, but it does not have the ability to create things it has never seen before. And it's not limiting. I don't feel limited. I feel grateful and powerful knowing I have power enough to manifest whatever I'd like. It's not upsetting for me to not be a God. I'm good with being His creation.

One's subconscious beliefs are exactly what creates their life and experiences, but, as I said before, you can believe whatever you want to, although, as fizzy said, your beliefs are very limiting.

You believe they are limiting. I belive they aren't. But thank you <3 we can all agree to disagree, it's okay! That's life. Differences make the world colourful

**Posted by unicornsandrainbows** 11/23/2018 8:23 pm

oceanitrogen wrote:
My point here is: We're cocreaters. Not creaters. Why do we need to let it go and put it in the hands of the Universe to do it for us? Because it's the Universe (God) who has the real power. We simply have the power to cocreate with it. But it is the Universe who does it all for us. We're not Gods exactly because of that. We don't have the power to create new things, we can only take what the universe gives us and manipulate it, but we're not able to create things from nothing. And if everything was our conciousness, people wouldn't be so different from us and see things differently and perceive things their own way exactly because we don't have that ability to create things from nothing. If everything was our conciousness, that's mean that we create a reality where people are absurdly different from everything we are and believe and we create that out of nothing because it doesn't exist inside us. And our subconcious is not able to create people and differences. It is not. We can't even create faces. When we dream, we dream faces we have seen before. Our brain isn't able to create. We are not able to create. Because creating is having nothing and building something. Humans can only modify what already exists, but we cannot create. We cocreate. Yeah. I think I finally put it into words in a way that makes sense.

I just wanted to add to fizzy's and Cynthia's astute comments...oceanitrogen, you've *almost* got something right here. We are not creators, we are selectors. Everything that you could ever imagine has already been created, but it is a gift to you, as god in physical form, to choose how you want to experience who you are. This is a quote from Neville:

The most astute book in the Bible is Ecclesiastes. In it we are told: "What has been is what will be and what has been done is what will be done; and there is nothing new under the sun. Is there a thing of which it is said, 'See this is new? It has been already in ages before us, but there is no remembrance of former things, nor will there be remembrance of things yet to happen among those who come after." This statement is difficult for man to grasp, for he is forever thinking of progress. Man sees things today and thinks they are new and wonderful because he cannot remember them. Just a century ago electricity was unknown. Now we have light powered by nuclear energy and think it was created for and by us, but scripture tells us it has always been! The play of life moves in a wheel, closed-circuited by time, and man with his short memory cannot remember other times.

You, in human form, will NEVER create something which has not already been created by the greater you, for everything under the sun has already been done, and at some point you will play ALL of the parts. You are the writer, the director, all of the players, and the dreamer. Everything that you experience is your dream, and if you become awake in your own dream, that's when the fun begins. That's when you can begin to decide exactly what you want to experience, and the way you do that is to appropriate the state which would be yours if you were experiencing it right now. It's as simple as that. Whatever state you are in right NOW, has moved me to reply to your thread from months ago. The universe isn't out there; it is inside of you. As long as you keep placing the power outside of you, you will be missing out on a lot of fun.

Last edited by unicornsandrainbows (11/23/2018 8:25 pm)

**Posted by Aquilina** 11/23/2018 9:10 pm

Here is my view...

I have still been struggling with all of these concepts. I understand them completely (I think), but I can't just accept it as reality since it's a thing we cannot prove. What I mean by that is, we can see the effects of how our imagination creates reality, but we don't physically see and can't measure the mechanism by which it happens. For example, if a caveman saw an aeroplane in flight, he would see "flight", he would see the effect, which is flight...the effects of the engine, all the inner workings of the plane, without knowing how it's working. Well, I feel like that is as much as I can know about manifestation right now, because I can't prove anything other than working with the effect, the observable results, seeing correlations.

This whole concept that everyone else are projections was deeply troubling for me when I first started considering it, even with the idea of there being versions of people. It would mean that memory is a lie, for a start. I spent about 5 days straight in a completely detached state, and I just couldn't function. It was very depressing, extremely lonely, and didn't feel like the answer. People were genuinely concerned about me, saying "we are real" etc. And apparently, there are enough people feeling the same that it even has a name..."Solipsism Syndrome". It's not a recognised disorder but they approach it in a similar way to other types of dissociative disorders. It is named after the Philosophical theory, Solipsism, that one cannot prove that anything exists outside of their own mind.

Well, if God loves us, how could such a truth be real, if knowing it would ruin somebody's life? It felt wrong in my heart and in my mind. That doesn't mean it is wrong, but at least my perception of it is. How do we know that it's not all a big paradox, that we only think we are choosing what to create based on desires, but we decided before we came here exactly what we would desire and therefore create, and so it is all perfectly co-ordinated with the desires of all, and that we are experiencing a particular path through existence that we had already chosen? I'm not saying it's true, it's just an example of an alternative that we also can't prove.

Another thing that I had to ask myself was, if all exists only in my perception...well, my parents existed before I was born. Allegedly they were thinking their own thoughts and having their own experiences. How can that be explained? And then what if in "my Mum's universe" she met my Dad, but in "my Dad's universe", they never met? Well, then in how many versions of reality do I exist? And what about global events? What if a volcano I didn't even know about erupts somewhere across the world, did I create that? What about some political situation, where traditionally people would say the collective consciousness created it?

Or, what about witnessing another person consciously create something that you had nothing to do with but they are creating their reality? Then in what reality is being shared in that instance? "Whose" reality is it happening in? What if you had no expectation about it and found out afterwards or were generally indifferent about it? In that case, WHY did you witness it?

I've been keeping a list of questions of this nature. I feel like there is a lot unexplained by both views of reality, but I'm mainly doing it to keep myself sane. There are so many questions without answers and I can't commit to believe that I know how it works, I can only do what works and experience the effects.

I started looking into information about the holographic universe. I found an interesting declassified CIA document about that and some other aspects about of the Universe in general, and their model agreed with the usual consensus that we do have individual consciousness that we retain even after returning to Source. That point probably needs more elaboration but anyway...all I know is if an idea makes me feel like life isn't worth it then I must be missing some information.

I don't even want to think about it. I just want to manifest my person and leave all this behind, but it's hard to ignore something that has had such a disruptive effect. But essentially, I don't know what the truth is, may never know, but I can't convince myself I don't believe in something just because it sounds crazy or whatever, when there is logic to support it. If you want to do that, then good luck to you because you will probably be happier than I feel right now. I have actually been wanting to discuss this with people as well but I knew going to any Neville based forum would lead to the same answers. I didn't want to post it on here as I know that there are generally two opposing views and everyone seems quite content with these ideas. I just want to know how people can live a normal life with this knowledge.

Last edited by Aquilina (11/23/2018 11:12 pm)

**Posted by Aquilina** 11/23/2018 9:32 pm

I mean think about it...how strong is the instinct in humans to belong, to interact, to socialise. Since we are divine, but are still humans...I just can't get my head around this concept without it feeling cruel and feeling like knowing too much.

How can one know they are in and are an illusion, and continue in the illusion, knowing that it's an illusion, and be happy about it and still have desire? It kind of makes me want to go to some mountain, become a buddhist and wait for it all to be over. Sorry to sound so depressing, I don't want to bring anyone down, but I just have been wanting to talk to someone about this so much, someone that has been through similar trains of thought and found a way to view things that can actually be reassuring.

Last edited by Aquilina (11/23/2018 10:03 pm)

**Posted by unicornsandrainbows** 11/24/2018 9:04 am

Aqualina, the short answer is this: once you begin to observe and notice that *everything* in your world, everything that happens to you, everything that you hear about, every person who comes into your life, was all first in your imagination, then a world of fun opens up to you. You are no longer the victim of anything, because ANYTHING you experience that you don't like, you have the power to change. And that includes seeming others. You can lift up anyone you choose to, simply by changing your concept of them. And once you begin doing this regularly, and getting to witness a reflection of what you did in your own wonderful human imagination, life becomes magical! It's like any other skill, however. You don't just wake up one day and know how to play the piano like Beethoven...you have to practice.

Think of it like a dream. In your dream of the night, there are many characters, and unless you are having a lucid dream, you believe those characters to be separate from you. You believe they have free will, and power to do things TO you. But when you wake up, you realize it was all you...you dreamt up those characters, you gave them all a role to play. And if you woke up in your dream, and began lucid dreaming, you'd realize you can manipulate your own dream to go any way you want it to go. So it changes from a nightmare to a wonderful playground. But you still get to interact with the others you have "created", and feel all of the feelings, have all of the experiences, you wish to have.

**Posted by Aquilina** 11/24/2018 10:31 am

Well, I disagree that literally everything in the world is created by the individual. Almost everyone has some darkness in them, but there are some levels of darkness of the things that go on in this world, that I know I don't share. I won't talk about what things these are because I don't want to upset anyone. What happens that is relevant to an individual, that they experience, is created by them, but the other stuff can't be, or if it is, it's a very far fetched idea to believe without proof.

My point wasn't about what's possible, my point is, I can't assume that things work in a certain way without proof, I mean scientific proof. There are still so many unanswered questions. I can only experience the effects of whatever goes on to make the things happen that I create. But most importantly, if it was true, if nothing is real, what's the point? It makes other people seem like autonomous robots, and makes the desire to create anything, less important, because the desire for truth is stronger...but I am here and can't do anything about that, I came here for a reason, hence why I want to get on with it without wondering about all of it. Sometimes I am content saying to myself, okay, I'm going to experiment and create these things without wondering how it all works, and other times I give a lot of attention to these questions and I'd rather just get on with it and accept that I don't know, but it gets to me sometimes.

Last edited by Aquilina (11/24/2018 10:32 am)